Bernie has it right. The DNC represents the rich left leaning right.
I literally see voters saying the Democrats were too left leaning, jfc.
With parties like this, painful collapse is the only way to avoid multigenerational destitution.
There is no saving the United States as a framework. It is far too compromised, with too many methods installed to keep the people willfully ignorant and infighting as the owners suck their life forces dry for profit.
We can limp along and pretend that isn’t the case, but climate change, aka the reality that doesn’t give a shit about our self-delusion and greed worship, will force that collapse sooner rather than later. Reality can’t be bribed, deluded, disappeared, or discredited.
Enjoy living in delusion that a society can function in capitalist competition against itself, the ability to do so is coming to an end.
I literally see voters saying the Democrats were too left leaning, jfc.
I think its important to ask the people saying that to name specific examples of HOW they were too left leaning. People just want to hurt someone now because they are hurt - it doesn’t matter if they are punching left or right, if they perceive something as landing, it makes them feel better.
I am seeing Liberals online blaming minorities for not showing up when the reality is, across the board Dem voters didn’t show up.
The most I’ve seen anyone able to manifest is that she wasn’t an old white man, and instead, she was too radical, because she was black, indian, and a woman. I have seen milquetoast liberals saying this, black people saying this, indians saying this, and women saying this. I don’t really know how true it is, and I guess I never will know because she really didn’t run a good enough campaign for me to actually run any sort of postmortem analysis relative to someone else’s real turnout, because she wasn’t even a baseline democrat, she ran below the baseline in terms of promises. She campaigned with dick “killed a million people” cheney and his wife. I dunno. somehow I don’t believe that it’s because democrat voters are just super racist or sexist or whatever.
In hindsight, I think the big issue with her campaign was simply how little time they had. We should have done an actual fucking primary, or Biden should have bowed out sooner, or at bare minimum she should have simply been as inescapably in the headlines as humanly possible because apparently there’s a contingent of dense enough motherfuckers out there that people were searching who was running on election day.
Thats why Im blaming all the dem voters who didnt show for not showing
I literally see voters saying the Democrats were too left leaning
Could you elaborate on this? I’m confused as to what those voters mean. Polling suggests that actual left wing ideas (universal health cares, higher minimum wage, etc etc) enjoy broad popular support. For example, Missouri (a deeply red state) passed a higher minimum wage and paid sick leave by ballot measure. Are these voters unaware of what “left wing” means, or are they unaware of public opinion?
I’ve seen a couple of things in this direction as well. Joe Scarborough was complaining that the democrats are too woke, and that that’s why they lost the election. He was clearly advocating for throwing trans people under the bus next cycle. I’ve also heard a liberal buddy of mine say that democrats are moving with the American public, i.e., their right wing policies are a reflection of what the American public wants.
Here on lemmy.world I see it more indirectly. The predominant sentiment is to blame the voters (“you didn’t show up”, “oh you just had to care about the genocide”, “look what you’ve done”). This operates on the false assumption that if the party changes their position to be more left wing (pro-peace, pro-healthcare, whatever) to woo the lost voters, they’d lose even more votes because the American public is so right wing.
Where are you seeing it?
“BE A BETTER CANDIDATE” - Jonathan Pie
I think they’re making a distinction between policy issues and social issues. The policy issues are popular but the social issues not so much. I read that R’s ran a huge ad buy with an anti-trans ad that was very effective in swinging lots of male voters over to them. That’s one example of what they mean by the “woke” stuff. It scares conservatives and moderate dems–not the objective reality of the policies as much as messaging spin they put on it, designed to create fear and loathing. Like it or not, it’s effective.
We also want to congratulate our friends in the Republican party, they played a great game and we can’t wait to work with them more.
Republican National Committee Chair Michael Whatley is excited to see his colleagues at the DNC make the same mistakes over and over.
This is amazing.
“I saw how the DNC ignored voters, I saw how they talked down to people, and that just made my job easy. I go in and say ‘Democrats think you’re dumb, but Republicans think you’re a genius’ and these dopes eat it up like the slop they feed their pigs.
Holy fuck is this even satire anymore? I can literally see a GOP campaign official say that in private.
Aren’t most of DNC rich AF? I can only see them benefiting from Trump.
Now they can just sit and do fuck all, because they lost everything. I’d say that makes their dayjob easier.
64 percent of native americans voting trump was an eye opening stat for me. They are done w the status quo. 2020 it was 54 percent.
Oh they learned their lessons:
- blame minorities
- shift further right
They ran Harris thinking she would win based on her demographics. The DNC needs to learn that not everyone wants a black/LGBTQ/woman/etc candidate that just runs on their race/gender/sexuality.
They want someone that’s competent that will campaign on policies that will make their lives better. The DNC has moved so far away from the working class that the RNC, the party of wealthy creeps, has them.
They ran Harris because she was the only candidate they could justify shoehorning in without a primary, since she’s VP.
Why they didn’t want to run a primary is a great question. Probably cost and time, and name recognition. Studies show that often the candidate with the most name recognition wins. There’s wasn’t enough time to tell every person in America a brand new person’s name.
But usually VPs don’t do well when they run as president. Imo Dems are just trying to avoid another Bernie Sanders situation - a leftist with an authentic campaign and people who genuinely like them. More than anything, they gotta stop real progress in this country.
They lost the general because they refused to hold a legitimate primary. This wouldn’t of happened. They haven’t run a real primary since 2008 and look at how hard Obama won in a landslide after competing in a deep field of qualified and competent candidates.
Even in 2008, it was obvious Clinton was the DNC’s preferred candidate and DNC still had their thumb on the scale. Despite this, Obama still managed to come out ahead. And with a base that was actually excited about their chosen candidate, they turned out to vote and Obama won.
The only lesson the DNC learned from this is that they needed to push their thumb harder on the scales the next time around.
They learned two things: identity politics and weigh the scale down as hard as possible.
They obsessed over identity, to their long term detriment as some of the minority identities they fawned over are shifting their support towards trump.
Imo Dems are just trying to avoid another Bernie Sanders situation - a leftist with an authentic campaign and people who genuinely like them
100% this is why. They didn’t want any internal pressure for progressive policies or a public platform to voice them.
They ran Harris because she was the only viable option when it was clear that Biden was not. They did not run Harris thinking she would win at all, they ran her out of desperation because the incumbent was flatlining. It was not a choice, and it certainly was not one based on demographics. It was a “Hail Mary” and it failed as it was likely to do from the outset, and everyone who was paying attention knew that, yet had no choice but to hope for the best.
lol, you believe this? I don’t find it hard to believe that they put Biden though a primary, just to have him drop out…
IMO running Harris was the plan from the beginning. You know, which was kind of the problem, hijacking the primary.
To use your own words, you believe that?
This was not a grand conspiracy geez. Biden’s “primary” was perfunctory because we learned you never primary the incumbent. If he didn’t perform badly at the debate he probably wouldn’t have dropped out.
Off topic, by why in god do people refer to the democrats as the DNC as if it’s the acronym for the democratic party?
It’s a bit like someone calling every piece in chess a “pawn”. It’s not right technically, and it sounds dumb.
Because you guys all fall in line with whatever they say. EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.
So yeah, Democrats ARE the DNC.
I mean, folks on this site automatically label anyone who says they are Republican, conservative, or even just take issue with one single thing about the Democratic nominee as “racist, misogynist, xenophobic Nazi MAGA pieces of dog shit that deserve death”
I think you guys got the easier end of the bargain.
Just as an aside: I find it a bit funny that you used the “pawn” example with not one hint of irony.
Really? I’ve always seen them labeled as the GOP which makes a lot more sense than the DNC cause it actually stands for something.
The reality is even worse. They’re going to “learn” all the wrong lessons. They will shift further to the right, like they always do.
Yep, every time Dems can’t get enough votes from the left to win, because they aren’t “left/pure enough” for them, what they learn is to shift to the right to find votes.
Whereas since voters on the right will always vote for the one with the R by their name even if they don’t think the candidate is “right enough”, their party learns that it doesn’t have to move to the left to find enough votes and stays to the right or moves even further to the right.
Mindless sheep sycophant party that abuses the system to stay relivent VS super-diverse big tent party than “takes the high road” and it is still almost 50/50…tells you where the people actually stand and how badly the broken system empowers the shitty minority. Oh, before “huurrrrddduuuurrrrr but popular vote dduuurrrrrrr”…that is how many people of each ideology VOTED not how many there are. Glad I could clarify the obvious for you smooth brain twits that think you have a point.
The popular vote that trump won in addition to the electoral college? That popular vote? Democrats (the party apparatus) need to come to term with themselves and look in the mirror for answers as to why there’s a second trump term on the horizon.
And you’ll be the bad guy for not wanting to vote for a right wing party.
The only ones that need to learn are the vile pieces of shit that chose to throw their vote away or not even vote. A politician doesnt give them all they want so they sacrifice the planet. Lowest of the low. Same kind of trash as maga
Would you prefer they DID vote for Trump? I voted for Harris because she was the only real option but after what the DNC keeps doing (see: fucking Bernie in the primaries and then not even having a primary this year) I really can’t blame anyone for not voting. The Dems need to have their come to Jesus and remember that the people don’t owe them anything.
I dont make a difference whether they voted for Trump or not. They both picked fascism. Primaries dont mean shit especially if they already have a president a power. It was a mistake to have Biden run again but that doesnt excuse not voting for democracy
Which do you think is better? Dems giving people what they want to earn their vote or trump winning?
Dems cant give people what they want because everyone wants different things.
What do you think is better? Preventing fascism or doing nothing and watching a fascist get into power?
Medicare for all or universal healthcare is incredibly popular. Peace is also popular.
Spectacular example of avoiding the question but answering it with it. You want to watch the fascism
Every single third party protest vote could have gone to Harris and she still would have heavily lost. She managed to even lose the damn popular vote by five million votes, despite Trump having a lower turnout than 2020.
This wasn’t because people voted third party, this was because at a time when incumbents have seen massive pushback across the globe from Covid inflation and Biden was unpopular across the board she ran as completely the same as Biden but even more Right on the border.
At a time when the politically disconnected working class families that make up the record trunout in 2020 were struggling with wage stagnation, erosion of Covid gains, and greedflation eroding their savings and pensions, four more years of the same but we’ll adopt even more Republican policies and look how many rich Republicans like us was never going to get the everperson off the damn couch.
More of the same is not a good platform for ‘progressives’ during economic hardship, even if it was out of their control and less hardship than most peer nations.
Even though Trump is a disaster for many of us, most people got though his first four years just fine, and don’t understand just how much damage he did or how much more he could do if the guardrails failed.
Getting the general public out to vote requires giving them something they want to vote for, and when the biggest thing you can point to doing or wanting to do more of is some clean energy related tax breaks that is a major problem.
Had the Dems impeached Clarence Thomas for his and his wife’s role in Jan 6, had Biden improved the immigration system like promised, had he provided free National Guard abortion clinics on federal land, had he made the FDA make puberty blockers and abortion medicine available by teleheath and mail, or indeed had any major victories in the last half of his term to show, we would not be here. Had they run AOC, Bernie, Waltz, or anyone at all who could articulate a platform beyond four more years of the same, we would not be here. Had Harris focused on how she could use left wing policy to fight the effects of late stage capitalism, we would not be here.
This election was an unforced error of the highest consequences, and one brought about by a political party that was so confident that until he dies of old age every politically disinterested Amarican would be so scared by the threat of Trump that they would maintain an unprecedented level of voter turnout without them having to actually do or promise anything.
I blame third party AND non voters. They and MAGA are all the same kind of scum who sacrificed your democracy.
Then, you’ll deal with this over and over until America becomes a completely fascist nation. That’ll teach those third party and non-voters. At least you’ll have your moral high ground, right?
America already will be a completely fascist nation thanks to the fascist enabling non voters
Not yet, it’s not completely fascist yet, but with the way you’re acting, there’s not going to be any significant resistance towards the US becoming a completely fascist country since you’re more interested in blaming each other instead of learning from your mistakes and work together to be better. What a defeatist mindset you have.
It will be completely fascist in January. And its thanks to non voters. They deserve all that is coming.
What should they really learn? I’m sick of the blame being placed on decent people not doing enough.
How about we blame the pieces of crap that support Trump who has too many disgusting qualities to list.
Okay you blamed them. What next?
Revolution? /s
It’s totally crazy to me that Trump and crew are planning who to use the full power of the United States to murder and the Democratic Party is trying to figure out who to blame for it.
We need them to fight or what good are they?
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The Democrats handed the election to Trump
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People are blaming Trump for all the issues he has caused
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The outside perspective has been wild. Everyone’s blaming the dem party for not winning, as if trump didn’t have 73 million plus fuckers voting for him.
They’ll learn the left never shows up, even when their human fucking rights are at stake. Next election the Dems will go hard center, to get the voters that actually show up. *We’re going to see them go hard on Clinton’s “It’s the economy, stupid”.
She was on a rocketship trajectory before getting Cheney on and focusing on old ex-R endorsements. There aren’t enough voters in the center and you can’t switch any magats is the takeaway.
She was on a rocketship trajectory before getting Cheney
That’s what we thought but apparently not. All this time a large chunk of Americans were getting brainwashed by social media algorithms that she’s going to start WW3, or going to let all the illegal immigrants in, or she is going to make gas even more expensive, or round up Christians or some other bullshit.
The DNC didn’t have a chance because the voters are fucking morons.
and you’re never going to be able to stop that, so you need to give the left who stayed home (as fucking stupid as that was) someone to be excited about
You think there are millions of self-proclaimed leftists in USA? Sure buddy.
And these ‘leftists’ saw who might be president and they still chose to abstain?
Good job. 👍
The DNC saw who their rival is and decided to move in that direction instead of catering to the millions that are not voting because of their lacklustre policies. Good job the DNC as well, then.
What about the ones who are voting but doesn’t use their voice to pressure the DNC to adopt more progressive policies, but instead prefer to alienate the left even more by attacking them the whole way up to the election. I’m sure they’re happy with their decision, as well.
I think my sarcasm wasn’t clear to you so let me say it in clearer terms:
The left in USA is a myth. There aren’t millions of leftists waiting for DNC to do the right things and give them perfect unicorn to vote for so they can get off their asses.
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Oh c’mon, Kamala was pretty far from Jesus, and Trump and co. are no political masterminds. This was the dems race to lose and they brilliantly pulled it off by exhibiting what can only be described as an active disdain for anything that even smelled like progressive politics. Turns out you can’t win on “the other guy is worse.” They fucked up and lost fair and square.
Look, the Democrats are not good at running campaigns, but I will never let that obscure the fact that OVER 75 MILLION Americans were ready, willing, and able to vote for a proven rapist, convicted criminal, openly racist, riot-starting adult crybaby. Not grudgingly – they went to the polls with a song in their hearts and blood in their eyes! The fucking Democrats didn’t cause that – 12 years of Fox News telling people that DJT was God, and four years of blaming COVID and inflation on desperate economic migrants did that.
Even IF the Democrats have enough of a base to overwhelm those +75m hateboner-stroking bigots, well they knew what’s at stake and STILL stayed home. (No doubt smirking at how cleverly they avoided any moral contagion via the brilliant gambit of continuing to pay taxes but not casting a vote 🙄 .) Regardless of all that, I don’t blame them for Trump’s win either, because there shouldn’t have been +75 million Trump-lovers to overwhelm in the first fucking place.
weren’t we as well vilifying anyone who criticised her stance on genocide and the brutal genocide in gaza rates much higher than anything you said about trump. add that to her history of being cosy with lobbyists, her controversial career as prosecutor and she will be the classic pro-war neocon we all hate. but majority of us still voted her in name of lesser evil.
in the same way i think a significant chunk of those 75 million think they are voting for lesser evil in name of god, increased crime and inflation.
plus the absolute cringe and elitist approach of dnc to label anyone not unconditionally supporting them as super racist sexist nazi.even now every left sub on .world and reddit is making fun of working class by mocking egg prices and even wishing for trump to deport the muslims and nuke gaza.
i think a significant chunk of those 75 million think they are voting for lesser evil
Oh no. I can assure you they were very deliberately voting for the largest evil they could find.
Which is crazy. In most countries, all parties are despised. In US, it is more like sports team.
Why are all you fools like “HA! BY NOT VOTING I SURE SHOWED THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY”?
you played YOURSELVES. You’re the one that’s gonna suffer not the party. It’s like you shot yourself just to spite Democrats, and you don’t realize that it’s you who is fucked, not the Democratic party
You aren’t going to like this, but there just isn’t a reason to vote for Democrats if they aren’t going to oppose the Republicans on anything but the personality of Donald Trump.
Sure, they give us lip service, they even throw in goodies once in a while! You get all warm and fuzzy imagining all the things you can “move them” on, but even if they do “listen” to you, (seriously, you guys didn’t even like their platform, and you’re the ones loyal to them. Whose votes are they earning if not yours??) they get challenged and they throw their hands up and say “guess there’s nothing that could be done” and Republicans get whatever they want anyways.
It’s the same outcome, this one just makes you feel bad and dare I say it might actually move you to act.
Again with the “YOU” aren’t gonna like this. No man it’s you voters who fucked yourselves. The Democratic party is gonna survive and it’s politicians aren’t gonna get poorer. It’s you who suffers
I bet your solution is to just vote harder for the same fucking assholes who are fucking us all over! That will show them!
Stupid stupid stupid.
Yeah your solution of not voting at all and allowing Trump to win is a much better option lol
I voted third party thank you very much. Trump voters voted for trump. Harris voters voted for Harris. Third party voters voted for third parties. The democrats ran an awful candidate and then have the audacity to whine bitch moan and scream about how it’s voters fault that they ran a shit ass candidate.
2016 all over again. Trump would of won 2020 too if covid never happened. The democrats are a decaying corpse of a political party and need to be replaced.
Doing the same thing over and over, failing, and expecting it to somehow work if you just do it harder next time is fucking madness.
DECADES OF NEOLIBERALISM CREATED THE MATERIAL CONDITIONS FOR FASCISM TO TAKE ROOT.
You voted the way Trump wanted you to, way to go fascist
Really felt the need to embody that headline huh.
The voters must come to the party, not the other way around.
If standing against fascism doesn’t bring the leftists to vote, you’re doomed. And AGAIN, you only fucked yourselves. The Democratic party isn’t gonna suffer, YOU are.
They’ve had four years to deal with the fascism problem and so far they’ve done Jack shit.
Ah ok that’s why you just stood off to the side and allowed fascism to win? The Democratic party didn’t end fascism, so you may as well join the fascists?
I voted third party. What are the democrats doing to fight fascism other than… courting fascists themselves?
You guys really are fucked. I thought just the right way stupid in your country but it’s all of you. And you guys love fascism. You facilitated it.
I can’t in good consciousness vote for genociders, so I voted third party, my only anti genocide option.
CRY ABOUT IT.
Lol the third party candidates are also anti Palestine. That’s why you should not make another country’s war, your one issue election in your own country. Especially when every candidate is against you. All you did was allow the worse one to win, insuring the destruction of Palestine which is now on your hands. Way to support genocide
Nice circular logic there bud. You late for after school debate class? Is mom checking your homework?
Whatever. I’m done arguing with you Americans. I used to think you guys were stupid, now I know you’re actually fascists. You’ve collectively become the dumbest people on earth
The funniest part of this is the idea that there will be an opposition party in anything but a token way after this.
…was there one before?..
Was there a party that did not install SCOTUS justices that were so ideologically conservative that they did things like end national legal abortion and gut the ability of government regulation agencies to regulate?
Yes there was. But that party is not coming back except as a token now because people just didn’t think stopping the rapist fascist dictator was a good enough reason to vote.
But that party is not coming back except as a token now because people just didn’t think stopping the rapist fascist dictator was a good enough reason to vote
“The party didn’t think stopping the rapist fascist dictator was a good enough reason to listen to their voters”
FTFY
Nope. They can’t force anyone to vote for them. People thought not voting was a better plan than stopping the rapist fascist dictator when they only had two possible choices.
There was an absolute mountain of evidence that Trump would be a disaster. They didn’t vote anyway because they knew they weren’t going to get a pony.
Voting for people in a two-party system is the stupidest thing you can do because you will never get your way with any one politician. So you vote against and keep voting against until you get closer and closer to what you want.
Just not voting or voting for third party candidates that will clearly lose against someone who has an automatic 30% of the vote doesn’t stop the worst possible thing from happening and it never will.
If you didn’t vote to stop Trump from getting into office, I blame you. You had warning after warning and your idealism was more important to you.
They can’t force anyone to vote for them.
Yup, which is why you need to give them reason to vote.
Democrats have been parading around “most important election of our lifetime” for fucking years - don’t be surprised that it didn’t work yet again.
The reason why Trump is popular is because there is legitimate pain and struggle in the working class, and he affirmed that pain and struggle (even if he was misidentifying the source of that pain). Telling voters “things are good, actually, and the other guy is gonna ruin it” is just dumb.
Democrats didn’t run on popular policy and they got destroyed because of it.
They had a reason to vote.
Their reason was that a rapist fascist who quoted Hitler and clearly has dementia that promised to deport millions of people and be a dictator on day one only had a 50/50 chance of being president.
And they didn’t care because they didn’t like Kamala Harris much. Was she any of those things? No. But her boss is funding the same genocide in Israel that Trump said to Netanyahu “finish the job” about on national television, so no one better vote for her either!
Sorry, not a good enough reason to not stop Trump. Not a good enough reason to refuse to vote. Not a good enough reason to vote third party.
For fuck’s sake, do you think people voted for Joe Biden in 2020 because they thought he would be a terrific president?
do you think people voted for Joe Biden in 2020 because they thought he would be a terrific president?
they voted for Biden because he made meaningful concessions to the progressive caucus. He gave Bernie a prominent roll in his campaign and made promises about student loan forgiveness and raising the minimum wage, on top of affirming people’s anxiety about covid and a pledge to address it.
Harris had none of that. She didn’t primary against progressive candidates, didn’t have to address progressive concerns, and when there was vocal opposition to any of her policies she said “excuse me, i’m speaking”. She was more right-moderate than Biden was, even if only because she didn’t face the progressive primary he did.
Who said “things are good actually”?? Seems to me that Harris had plenty of policy proposals that would have resulted in a meaningful improvement to the bottom line of the average American.
Biden has also been better for the average American than trump was. For fucks sake, Trump actually got away with raising taxes on all of us to support his tax cut for the rich, simply because the average person is too low information to grasp the idea of a tax cut that expires!
So yeah, plenty of actual reasons to say that one candidate is better than the other, without needing to be wowed by an actual messiah who can dismantle our fucked up system and solve everybody’s problems.
They repeatedly touted our economic recovery was ‘the best in the G6’.
Even when our economy is ‘good’ it’s shit for most people. That’s the problem with being a neoliberal status quo party: it doesn’t help most of the people they need to vote for them
